Atlus or Square?

[Indigo]

These two are probably the best RPG companies at the moment, but which do you think really do you think deserves to be called best?

This is definitely a hard one but I'll have to go with Square because I grew up with square, square game me some of my favorite games like Kingdom Hearts, Final Fantasy, SO and my most recent favorite, TWEWY. However if I were to know about Atlus sooner I'd probably go with them. I'm pretty new to Atlus to be honest. I love the SH series, I'm playing Nocturne at the moment which is an awesome game, and I have played persona 3, which even thought I thought it could be boring at times it was in all a pretty good game.

[Phakiel]

Man **** Squenix, Atlus is the bomb. Their games are inherently better than the crap that Squenix releases, i am glad we finally got Atlus working in the Western market, more so now when Squenix is a mere shadow of what it once was.

Atlus is also worthy of praise for only single thing, they actually ask and listen to their fanbase. They know they have a limited fanbase but they treat us the best way they can. They are constantly doing polls, interviews and research to provide their consumers with what they want and I think thats something no other company does. And Atlus is not just a simple developer trying to make it big, they have been around for a while and always deliver quality products.

Even their weakest game for the ps2, Devil Summoner is enjoyable.

[Cyrus the virus]

I like both, but I've literally never played an Atlus RPG I didn't like or love.

[Phakiel]

As opposed to FFX-2 (shut up Zeal, I dont want to hear it) or Dragon Quest VIII (shut up Raidou, i dont want to hear it).

[DrunkSwashbuckler]

Yeah, Magna Carta was awesome, wasn't it?

[Phakiel]

To be fair, Atlus only published that.

[DrunkSwashbuckler]

Fair enough; I'm merely of the opinion that everyone associated with that game should be flayed.

Edit: Though it would be remiss of me to not point at that I did have fun, albeit by fooling friends into saying that the "chicks" on the cover are hot... I miss college.

[Phakiel]

I almost bought it but heard so many bad things about it and also that the main character who looked like a chick was a dude, and that there were like 10 other characters that also looked like chicks but were dudes.

Whats wrong with koreans anyway? Sush, care to explain? Is starcraft to blame?

[DrunkSwashbuckler]

The main character's look and outfit is actually a distraction in the game; you simply can't take him seriously.

[Atlas]

Square and Atlus are both awesome in my book. Although, Atlus is definitely more original with its games, I'd say.

[Brian]

Atlus always make interesting games. I don't think I remember them ever making a bad one (hit me with it if I'm wrong). So they get my vote. Why not square-enix? They're slippin'. Period.

[Void]

I don't even have to look at the poll or read any of the posts in this thread to know that Atlus is winning. By the way, I voted Atlus. Of course.

[Luisfe]

Since Atlus makes the Megaten games, it wins by default.

[Temporal Distortion]

Square. They've created Valkyrie Profile 2 and The World Ends with You, two flawless RPGs. Atlus' games never appealed to me gameplay-wise. Disgaea, after all, wasn't an Atlus game.

[Fabs]

Erm, wasn't VP2 a Tri-Ace game? SE only published it, kinda puts a rest to your Disgaea point.

Also, Fallen, if by SH you mean Shadow Hearts, then no, it's not an Atlus game. And SO, like VP, is Tri-Ace, not, at the time, Enix. Geez, Square has nothing to do with bloody SO.

Get your facts straight, people.

[Sushi_b]

I like both, but I've literally never played an Atlus RPG I didn't like or love.

I'd have to say that Lufia: Ruins of Lore was pretty bad and probably the worst game I've played under the ATLUS label.

I'd choose Atlus for sure. Aside from a very limited number of games such as DQ and CT, I'm not that fond of anything that Enix-Square puts out. Even their published only games aren't that great to me. Plus Atlus shows a lot of DS and GBA love with great games like Double Dragon Advance and River City Ransom EX.

Phak, I don't know what the deal is with gaming in Korea. You know the DS was only finally released here about a year ago and the Wii only came out on April 22nd. They have a lot of strange attitudes here and they are always constantly getting "tired" of things that aren't "New" any more. Anything that is older then 6 months is no good. The only exceptions are Starcraft and a few other PC titles from the US. Mostly, Korean games just suck IMO. Kart Rider blows!

I've played Magna Carta for a little bit but I didn't find it that interesting myself either.

[Cyrus the virus]

Maybe I was too quick to make that point, since I haven't played Magna Carta or that new Lufia game. Regarding Lufia, though, I just knew better than to even look into it :p After Lufia 2, I'd had my fill and anything beyond would have been a disappointment.

[Indigo]

They've created Valkyrie Profile 2 and The World Ends with You, two flawless RPGs.

Agree with TWEWY but VP2 was far from flawless.

I think the bottom line here is that Square has it's up and downs while Atlus is steady with good quality all the way. Megaten RPGs are great, if I were to know about them earlier on I would probably prefer Atlus.

Oh and Magna Casta sucks ass.

[Fabs]

Wtf dude, do you even read? They DID NOT make VP2. This is sad.

[Blackdragon]

Square made Chrono Trigger and The World Ends With You, enough said.

[Cyrus the virus]

Atlus made more than two great games, enough said.

[Indigo]

Wtf dude, do you even read? They DID NOT make VP2. This is sad.

lol sorry I skipped your post, I have a thing with not reading posts without avatars, but I don't do it consciously, sorry, my bad.

[Phakiel]

Thats because only animals dont have avatars.

[Temporal Distortion]

Erm, wasn't VP2 a Tri-Ace game? SE only published it, kinda puts a rest to your Disgaea point. SE's tri-Ace's exclusive publisher. And NIS has been publishing Disgaea on its own for a while now.

[Blackdragon]

Atlus made more than two great games, enough said.

Mind if I ask what those games were? I can't recall any good ones that I'd like. Only one I even want to play is Operation Darkness, even that isn't a great game by most standards.

Plus I only used those two as some examples. I also like Kingdom Hearts, Chrono Cross, Vagrant Story, Star Ocean 3, Secret of Evermore, Secret of Mana, Seiken Densetsu 3, Super Mario RPG, Illusion of Gaia, Front Mission 4, Grandia 3, Radiata Stories, and a few of the Final Fantasy games as well.

[Lodis]

Both companies suck in my book given they won't collaborate, or at least work something out, in order to revive the Ogre series.

[Brian]

The only thing saving square enix are the FF7 fanboys and the enix games which.. aren't going anywhere unfortunately =/. Think about it, a third chrono installment will never come true cause they're scared they'll **** it up ;p. Atlus , so far, is going on a great start the past few years. I guess not many people are into that crazy supernatural type of games..whatever ya call it.

And yes.. we need a revival on the Ogre series.

[Cyrus the virus]

I can't recall any good ones that I'd like.

Holy shit.

And you're not allowed to list Enix games. I'd also argue against Squaresoft games just because Square now =/= Squaresoft in 1997. You smell.

[Abominari]

Think about it, a third chrono installment will never come true cause they're scared they'll **** it up ;p.
No, they won't make one because they're scared it won't make money. If Chrono Cross sold like Final Fantasy VII we'd be swimming in Chrono sequels right now.

[Sushi_b]

Just because Chrono Cross didn't make as much money as FF VII, that doesn't mean that it won't make money. As far as I'm aware it was easily on the greatest hits list for PSX games and that should mean it sold over 500,000 copies to make it a GH game. Hardly something for them to scoff at and decide to not make a new Chrono game. It's most likely got to do with the original team having gone their seperate ways years ago (even before CC).

As for Ogre Battle games, it's strange that there hasn't been any at all. Quest was bought out by Square some time ago but hasn't worked on any new properties. Does Atlus own the Ogre Battle name? Why doesn't Square start a new IP with Quest at the helm?

[Indigo]

Holy shit.

And you're not allowed to list Enix games. I'd also argue against Squaresoft games just because Square now =/= Squaresoft in 1997. You smell.

Well it is Square - Enix. as much as you probably don't like it they're one now.

[Brian]

Yeah. the worst part of it, it's only a matter of time before Tetsuya Nomura turns every single enix game into people with zippers and giant shoes. *shrugs*

[Indigo]

Yeah. the worst part of it, it's only a matter of time before Tetsuya Nomura turns every single enix game into people with zippers and giant shoes. *shrugs*

Hey I'll have you know that KH is a great game and the design for the outfits is nothing more that orginal.

[Brian]

Without a doubt , KH is a great series, so it's only right that the designs remain the same solely for the main cast and disney characters. I mean look what they did to Samurai Legend Musashi? Fun game but all the heavy clothes and big hairs just didn't do it for me. What saved it was the fact that he is Musashi from the last game and the music was none other than the one and only, Masashi Hamauzu ;p.

[Indigo]

Without a doubt , KH is a great series, so it's only right that the designs remain the same solely for the main cast and disney characters. I mean look what they did to Samurai Legend Musashi? Fun game but all the heavy clothes and big hairs just didn't do it for me. What saved it was the fact that he is Musashi from the last game and the music was none other than the one and only, Masashi Hamauzu ;p.

Hey I remember reading about that game. was it an RPG or just an action adventure game?

[Brian]

Action/adventure game with level ups on swords and finding out the secret part of them. Just like the original, a classic but a little too rehashed as well. The healin energy balls resembles KH. Try and play the game. I promise the music won't hurt but will have you feel nostalic ;p.

[Indigo]

So it's basically a bit like KH, but with a bit less RPG factors. works for me, trouble is finding the game now. I think I only glanced at the box once.

[Cyrus the virus]

Well it is Square - Enix. as much as you probably don't like it they're one now.

Square is not Enix. I refuse to refer to Square as the makers of Enix games from the 90's. Butthead.

[Brian]

Square is not Enix. I refuse to refer to Square as the makers of Enix games from the 90's. Butthead.

Oh don't worry.. they're the makers and the downfall of enix games. Only thing they got going is there "UBER GRAFFIX" . Therefore, just call them squaresoft for your own convenience ^^

[Abominari]

Level-5 did a good job with Dragon Quest VIII, and I really enjoyed Rocket Slime. DQIX looks nice.

[neogodzilla77]

As much as I love both of these companies I have to go with Square-Enix. Square has Final Fantasy, Star Ocean, Secret of Mana and it goes on and on

[spaghetti junction]

kinda bias toward square-enix since i grew up on their games and never gave atlus much of a shot. i've been playing more atlus games now and i like them... but there's just too much history between me and square not to give them credit

[BAMAJAMA]

I guess, I would have to lean slightly towards Squenix but I like quite a few Atlus games as well. Shadow Hearts, for example. BTW, are any of the Megaten games, I saw listed earlier, available for the US market. I have to admit, I have not seen those games in US stores.

[Indigo]

The megaten games are rare to find. And they're out in America. I have almost all of the EU released megaten games(if not all of them) and I love them.

[BAMAJAMA]

How many are there and is Megaten in all the titles, I may look them up on ebay or amazon

[Indigo]

The PS2 ones that I know of are:
-Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne(US)/ Luciver's call(EU)
-Shin Megami Tensei: Digital Devil Saga 1 and 2
-Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Summoner - Raidou vs. the Soulless Army
-Shin Megami Tensei: Persona 3
-Shin Megami Tensei: Persona 3 FES

That's all I know of for the PS2.

[BAMAJAMA]

Oh, I have always called them SMT games, I had never heard of them called Megaten. I have played all those except Devil Summoner and P3. I have played p3FES, that was one of the last PS2 games I played.

[Indigo]

Yeah if you want a full list:

1987

09/11 : Digital Devil Story: Megami Tensei (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Devil_Story:_Megami_Tensei) (FC, MSX (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MSX), Mobile phone) 1990

04/06 : Digital Devil Story: Megami Tensei II (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Devil_Story:_Megami_Tensei_2) (FC, Mobile phone) 1992

10/30 : Shin Megami Tensei (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei) (SFC, PCE, MD, PS, GBA, VC)12/23 : Megami Tensei Gaiden: Last Bible (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megami_Tensei_Gaiden:_Last_Bible#Megami_Tensei_Gai den:_Last_Bible) (GB, GBC, GG)

1993

11/19 : Megami Tensei Gaiden: Last Bible II (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megami_Tensei_Gaiden:_Last_Bible_II) (GB, GBC) 1994

01/28 : Majin Tensei (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majin_Tensei) (SFC, Win2000)03/18 : Shin Megami Tensei II (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei_II) (SFC, PS, GBA)10/28 : Shin Megami Tensei if... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei_if...) (SFC, PS) 1995

02/19 : Majin Tensei II: Spiral Nemesis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majin_Tensei_II:_Spiral_Nemesis) (SFC)03/04 : Last Bible III (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_Bible_III) (SFC)03/04 : Another Bible (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Another_Bible) (GB)03/24 : Megami Tensei Gaiden: Last Bible Special (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megami_Tensei_Gaiden:_Last_Bible#Megami_Tensei_Gai den:_Last_Bible) (GG)03/31 : Kyūyaku Megami Tensei (SFC)12/25 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Summoner (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil_Summoner) (SS, PSP) 1996

04/26 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Summoner ~Akuma Compendium~ (SS)09/20 : Megami Ibunroku Persona (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revelations:_Persona) (PS)

1997

04/04 : Giten Megami Tensei: Tōkyo Mokushiroku (PC98, Win 95/98)10/30 : Ronde (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronde) (SS)11/13 : Devil Summoner: Soul Hackers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil_Summoner:_Soul_Hackers) (SS, PS)12/23 : Devil Summoner: Soul Hackers Akuma Compendium Second Episode (SS, PS) 1999

06/24 : Persona 2: Tsumi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persona_2:_Tsumi) (PS) 2000

06/29 : Persona 2: Batsu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persona_2:_Batsu) (PS)11/17 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Children Black Book/Red Book (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children#Shin_Megami_Ten sei:_Devil_Children_-_Black_Book.2FRed_Book) (GB) 2001

07/27 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Children White Book (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children#Shin_Megami_Ten sei:_Devil_Children_-_White_Book) (GB)07/27 : Shin Megami Tensei Trading Card: Card Summoner (GB) 2002

03/28 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Chidren Black Book・Red Book (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children#Shin_Megami_Ten sei:_Devil_Chidren_-_Black_Book.2FRed_Book) (PS)11/25 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Chidren Book of Light/Book of Dark (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children#Shin_Megami_Ten sei:_Devil_Chidren_-_Book_of_Light.2FBook_of_Dark) (GBA)12/05 : Shin Megami Tensei: NINE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_NINE) Standalone version (Xbox) 2003

02/20 : Shin Megami Tensei III: Nocturne (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Nocturne) (PS2)07/25 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Chidren Puzzle de Call! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children#Shin_Megami_Ten sei:_Devil_Chidren_-_Puzzle_de_Call.21) (GBA)09/12 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Chidren Fire Book/Ice Book (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children#Shin_Megami_Ten sei:_Devil_Chidren_-_Fire_Book.2FIce_Book) (GBA) 2004

01/29 : Shin Megami Tensei III: Nocturne Maniax (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Nocturne) (PS2)05/26 : Shin Megami Tensei if...: Hazama chapter (Mobile phone)07/15 : Digital Devil Saga: Avater Tuner (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Digital_Devil_Saga) (PS2)08/26 : Shin Megami Tensei: 20XX (Mobile phone)11/04 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Chidren Messiah Riser (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Children) (GBA) 2005

01/27 : Digital Devil Saga: Avater Tuner 2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Digital_Devil_Saga_2) (PS2) 2006

03/02 : Devil Summoner: Kuzunoha Raidō tai Chouriki Heidan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_Megami_Tensei:_Devil_Summoner:_Raidou_Kuzunoh a_vs._The_Soulless_Army) (PS2)03/03 : Shin Megami Tensei Pinball: Judgement (Mobile phone)06/01 : Persona 3: The Night Before (WIN)07/13 : Persona 3 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persona_3) (PS2)12/01 : Megami Ibunroku Persona: Ikū no Tō Hen (Mobile phone)12/07 : Digital Devil Saga: Avater Tuner A's TEST Server (Mobile phone) 2007

03/30 : Megami Tensei IMAGINE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megami_Tensei_Online:_IMAGINE) (WinXP)04/19 : Persona 3 FES (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persona_3#Persona_3_FES) (PS2)04/27 : Shin Megami Tensei: Tōkyō Requiem (Mobile phone)04/27 : Megami Tensei QIX: Persona 3 (Mobile phone)05/15 : Megami Tensei CHANGING SOUL: Persona 3 (Mobile phone)05/28 : Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Colosseum 20XX (Mobile phone)07/11 : Majin Tensei blind thinker (Mobile phone)08/30 : Devil Summoner: Soul Hackers Intruder (Mobile phone) 2008

07/10 : Persona 4 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persona_4) (PS2)


And is you look at the game boxes for your SMT games you'll see a star symbol and megaten written in it, it's usually on the lower right corner of the box.

[BAMAJAMA]

Cool, now looking forward to P4

[UO_Duck]

Atlus. Shin Megami Tensei and its spinoffs, as well as Odin Sphere and other amazing niche titles, have pushed the RPG genre forward more than any S-E title in recent years.

[Siyama]

There should be a fourth option here - Both are Great.

[Phakiel]

No, Square WAS great.

[Siyama]

For some Yes, but in my opinion, many of the games Atlus have created was good as well.

[Nickoten]

It's kind of important to determine whether we're talking about the companies as just developers or as publishers, too. For example, should Square get credit for Breath of Fire? Similarly, should Atlus be credited for any of the large amount of games they published?

Personally, I like Atlus, for the reason I just described. Without them, we'd probably never see half the niche games in the US that we do, and of course we'd also be without the Megaten games, which for me is reason enough. As for Square Enix, well, at this point I don't have much love for the company, especially after their recent (http://www.siliconera.com/2007/04/20/square-enix-changed-its-business-model/) announcements (http://kotaku.com/5011016/square-enix-president-laying-down-the-law).

[Phakiel]

Developers, when someone says its great to have Atlus because Odin Sphere or Disgaea, they should be corrected.

[Siyama]

It's kind of important to determine whether we're talking about the companies as just developers or as publishers, too. For example, should Square get credit for Breath of Fire? Similarly, should Atlus be credited for any of the large amount of games they published?

Personally, I like Atlus, for the reason I just described. Without them, we'd probably never see half the niche games in the US that we do, and of course we'd also be without the Megaten games, which for me is reason enough. As for Square Enix, well, at this point I don't have much love for the company, especially after their recent (http://www.siliconera.com/2007/04/20/square-enix-changed-its-business-model/) announcements (http://kotaku.com/5011016/square-enix-president-laying-down-the-law).

Hello ... you're buying their games, NOT their stocks at the stock market. :D

You don't have to love the company to love the game. You just have to love the game. For example, the company maybe lousy but if they can make great games for us, then fine. I don't see what's a big deal about it.

As for who should get credits and such, that's not our businesses either. SQUARE, Atlus and other game companies can fight it out among themselves who should get the credits and rights for which companies.

As for that announcement by it's president. I think it is good. He makes a comment - "stop making games that only they wanted to play." This means that the man have noticed that the games which was coming out was not to the satisfaction of the players in the market.

[Nickoten]

Hello ... you're buying their games, NOT their stocks at the stock market. :D

You don't have to love the company to love the game. You just have to love the game. For example, the company maybe lousy but if they can make great games for us, then fine. I don't see what's a big deal about it.

As for who should get credits and such, that's not our businesses either. SQUARE, Atlus and other game companies can fight it out among themselves who should get the credits and rights for which companies.

As for that announcement by it's president. I think it is good. He makes a comment - "stop making games that only they wanted to play." This means that the man have noticed that the games which was coming out was not to the satisfaction of the players in the market.

The point is that their company policy changes have been mostly about the content that they deliver. Square Enix had made it very apparent they only want to appeal to the mass market, and they've also declared that they'll (somehow) focus even more on regurgitating the same material than they had before. That in itself makes me prefer Atlus in general, which is what the thread is asking.